SUMMARY KEYWORDS
laughter, frustration, communicate, ball, relationship, standards, evolve, timely responses, person, frustrates, hear, people, speak, episode, listeners, values, frustrated, inform, point
SPEAKERS
Kathi, Daisy
Daisy 00:03
Bald and Blonde. Welcome to the Mindset Evolution podcast. Hear about tips, tricks, skills, tools, inspiration, mental hygiene, know what you want and how to create what you desire to achieve predictable results and create a content life wherever you are. And here are your hosts, Kathi Tait and Daisy Papp.
Kathi 00:28
And Hello, everybody, and welcome to another episode of Bald and Blonde Mindset Evolution. I'm your host from Down Under, Kathi Tait the baldwarrior and with me, of course, as always, is Daisy Papp, international excellence coach and all-round amazing woman from Florida Keys. Hi, Daisy.
Daisy 00:50
Oh, thank you so much. That was such a sweet introduction. Thank you so much. Hello, Down Under dear Kathi, my sweet podcast partner and dear friend, I so appreciate our time together.
Kathi 01:00
I'm excited Daisy, this is Episode 40.
Daisy 01:05
Oh, wow congratulations. Aha, yes 40. Wow, (laughter)
Kathi 01:11
Yeah, cool.
Kathi 01:12
How much we recorded and how much we processed. And, wow, it's wonderful.
Kathi 01:16
And hopefully lots of value out there in the world, to our listeners who are growing weekly, we're excited to say, and hopefully we're imparting, I don't know some lessons to help you guys evolve out there. Because that's our aim is to help you guys change in increments, not giant steps, just baby steps so that you can make a difference in your own lives and become happier and healthier in yourselves and in your relationships.
Daisy 01:45
Absolutely. And I do believe that it is very important to keep it going and the speed doesn't really matter. It's the direction that matters.
Kathi 01:54
Absolutely. So on the note of relationships today, I want to talk about frustration.
Daisy 02:03
Oh, frustration? Oh, that's good. Okay, cool.
Kathi 02:07
I think so, I think it's a great topic, because I think it's one of those common denominators that we all experience from time to time. And it can be a tough one to handle. And sometimes it can evolve into harsher emotions. So I thought it'd be cool to talk about it and maybe give some tips to our listeners.
Daisy 02:29
Cool. Sure.
Kathi 02:30
You always come up with some gold Daisy, I don't know what it's going to be.
Daisy 02:34
Me neither, I don't know what's going to come out of me. I'm going to give my best for sure. So what is something that frustrates you? I do believe let's do it this way, because many listeners may feel similar. So what is something that you're frustrated about?
Kathi 02:50
Oh, I've got a good one. It's a bit of a pet hate, because it really does frustrate me. And it's not being answered. I feel like I'm being ignored and it frustrates me and it upsets me. So I'm talking to put it in context of a relationship, it would be when a guy I'm dating doesn't answer my text message, because I think that's rude. And then I get quite frustrated. So there's an example from my world.
Daisy 03:17
Very, very good.
Kathi 03:18
what frustrates you Daisy?
Daisy 03:20
I really have to think about it.
Kathi 03:22
Oh, I know. I know. When somebody doesn't keep their word that frustrates you, doesn't it?
Daisy 03:27
I'm not sure if it frustrates me. That hurts me. That's pain that I'm feeling I suffer when somebody promises something and doesn't keep it. That's not frustration, I think.
Kathi 03:37
Okay, so maybe we need to start with defining frustration.
Daisy 03:42
Yes. And let me just touch this iron until it's hot. So you mentioned that in a relationship when someone doesn't answer to your text message, correct?
Kathi 03:53
Yes.
Daisy 03:54
Okay. What does it mean to you? When somebody is not answering to your text message?
Kathi 03:58
It means they're ignoring me.
Daisy 04:00
Okay, now we hit the head on the nail. Because the meaning you give not receiving an answer equals ignoring me. That is what frustrates you. The fact itself. The belief, it triggers it, and that is the frustration part you see.
Kathi 04:18
So you're saying that feeling like I'm ignored is what frustrates me.
Daisy 04:24
Well, that causes the frustration, yes. It's like the fact of not receiving an answer in your appointed period of time generates that dis appointment, mmh? So that is where your vision how it's supposed to be, doesn't equal the reality.
Kathi 04:42
Oh my God, I'm putting expectations on. (Laughter)
Daisy 04:47
And then... Very good, you see?
Kathi 04:50
We just had a personal insight out there listeners. Isn't that great?
Daisy 04:56
So because you give that meaning, so you put an appointment how things supposed to be based on your value system, your little island in which you live, based on the island model principle metaphor and then because it doesn't happen the difference between the two pictures the appointed and reality is too big, it's out of balance and that causes the imbalance within you, follow me?
Kathi 05:23
Yeah
Daisy 05:23
Okay so now you can start defining what it is.
Kathi 05:26
Hang on, let me just say that The Island Model is a book that Daisy has written that is brilliant, so jump over to baldandblonde.live into the store, you can grab it there, it's well worth your time, it's very easy to read and it will transform the way you think fundamentally.
Daisy 05:45
Mmm
Kathi 05:45
Just had to get that in there because people are going to hear this and go what's the island model?
Daisy 05:49
Mm, yeah, yeah
Kathi 05:50
what it is?
Daisy 05:51
Okay yes, carry on.
Kathi 05:52
Okay let's define frustration.
Daisy 05:55
Yes, go ahead and define frustration. So what is your definition of frustration?
Kathi 05:59
Well, that is a good question (laughter). We don't research these episodes guys so winging it here, I don't know if i have a definition but I know how it makes me feel.
Daisy 06:12
Ah, now you got it again you see. So very big lesson here, there's so many words we're using and we have no clue what the definition is but we're using it or abusing it.
Kathi 06:24
I feel like i need to look it up (laughter).
Daisy 06:27
So the feeling that it generates within you, that is the problem so now tell me when someone's ignoring you, someone's ignoring you based on your perception, because maybe they're just busy or maybe they're sitting in the whirlpool or maybe they're just taking a pilot lesson or they're just asleep, taking a nap.
Kathi 06:46
Well I do give them longer than 10 minutes (laughter); you know I think a general rule is within 24 hours would be respectful, so rather than seeing it as an expectation, I like to serve as a standard, if you respect me, you're going to answer me.
Daisy 07:05
Okay let me ask you then this did you inform the other party that that is your standard?
Kathi 07:11
Well we're not talking about anybody in particular here, so hypothetically I'm going to make sure that if I date someone, they know that is my standard.
Daisy 07:22
Uh huh.
Kathi 07:22
And hopefully I'll be able to see from how they act as to the importance they place on me and my standards.
Daisy 07:30
Uh huh, and then here again you will not be able to force them to like your standards.
Kathi 07:36
No
Daisy 07:37
But you can inspire them how, by sharing with them how it will make you feel when they respect your standards.
Kathi 07:45
Yes
Daisy 07:45
So you see the word frustration is just one thing and we use it and abuse it as it just fits into our agenda and then we just move on and then i can justify my mood because I'm just so frustrated, mmh? So that is one point, the second point is that now we have a look at that big, huge, like the tip of the iceberg is the frustration, but what's underneath is really big fat ice. And now we found that, so therefore when we go in there and have a look at that what's underneath the water surface let's say when we speak about the iceberg, now that's when we can start talking, and that is when then the next step comes in, what are your skills? Because when I'm complaining that I'm so frustrated that I don't receive a timely answer because I never shared with them my standards, he sees something as kind of who's doing it to whom? Well I'm setting myself up for the frustration then, or for the feeling of being ignored and therefore it really hurts me because I don't feel important enough.
Kathi 08:49
So it's my own fault because i should have communicated my standards and like we do like to say let's take ownership of our part in all of these things that we talk about and I'm fully prepared to take ownership of this. So if I, in fact don't communicate to another person how it makes me feel when they don't answer me in say 24 hours and we're not talking about acquaintances I'm talking about people that I care about because I would never do it to them, but if I don't communicate that, then it's back on me.
Daisy 09:24
Well, I wonder how many of those people you really care about have crystal balls, are clairvoyants, seeing the future,
Kathi 09:32
only a couple (laughing),
Daisy 09:33
know exactly what you're thinking or thought-readers, so actually what I hear you say is that in the past, if I'm not mistaken, that you may have had your standards but not communicated to anyone out there and then at the end being disappointed, you dis appointed it, so it was the end of your appointment that only you knew about and the other person should have had a glass ball so all you who know Kathi from the past, we now solved the mystery that's going on, you didn't have a glass ball or crystal ball and now we know that actually, hey that's great that we're talking about this we clarified this part.
Kathi 10:16
I'm so happy that I can laugh at these things because some of these things that we talk about and when we use me as an example, I do have these epiphany moments like you've just heard in the last 10 minutes and I know that I am definitely on a path of learning to communicate this life, because it is something that has been tough for me and a challenge and something I'm learning as I go and especially in the context of relationships because I've had so many unhealthy ones that kind of warped me a little bit. I've had to unlearn some of that stuff and re-learn a better way.
Daisy 10:54
Good
Kathi 10:55
So I'm grateful for you and your mentorship there Daisy, because I can see, and I believe that the next proper loving relationship I do get into, I'm certainly going to be doing it a lot differently to the way I have in my past and the first thing that he will have to do is listen to all of our podcasts! (Laughter), he's got to pass the Daisy test people! (Laughter)
Daisy 10:55
That's so funny, okay so then maybe we can predict that your future husband is going to be a podcast listener, so listeners out there (laughter), matchmaking on.
Kathi 11:35
Look out listeners I'm coming for ya! (Laughter)
Daisy 11:38
No they're going to come to you because they listen to us!
Kathi 11:42
So I find a guy I like and I convert him into a podcast listener
Daisy 11:47
Oh we can do it this way around. Yes, we can do that way around too. So now when we speak about frustration I'd like to stick with this example that you brought up what frustrates you and not to expand or make it bigger or funny or not taking it seriously or making it more serious or less serious than it is, but I do believe there are many listeners out there who may have a similar level of frustration when that happens to them and those who have different frustrations in their lives, they can use this as an example what we can do to stop that frustration from building up.
Kathi 12:25
Yes, it's a great relatable example and I don't mind being the guinea pig (laughter).
Daisy 12:33
No, you're not we have that already. No I'm not seeing you as a guinea pig. No I think it is a very great example.
Kathi 12:41
Yes
Daisy 12:42
So let's have a look at it. So we already see that okay, so I was looking for some specific behavior in others that I didn't communicate clearly that is what I'm looking for.
Kathi 12:53
Yes, now I'll just interject here with I actually did look up the definition and number two says "the prevention of progress success or fulfillment of something" and the key missing there is that both parties know about the something, which is what you're getting at.
Daisy 13:11
Completely
Kathi 13:11
Yes
Daisy 13:12
But now here is, self-empowering minutes, coming here in this episode!
Kathi 13:17
Dum de dum! (laughter) My version of a drumroll because I can't do drums.
Daisy 13:25
You come up with the funniest things here, what's another surprise. Well, thank you, da, da, da, da, typical.
Daisy 13:33
So we came to the conclusion now in this very short amount of time that I am responsible for communicating clearly what is important to me and when it comes to speaking up about it I would not speak about the other person, I would keep it based on my communication suggestion, first person singular meaning I speak from my point of view and then I can say look I really like timely responses, whether that is phone calls, voice messages, text messages, emails and I'd like to inform you that when that is in a good flow, based on my timely message exchanging standards, it makes me feel really good because it shows me that I can rely on you. Now here's what happens, I am sharing my vulnerable point without even saying what happens within me because I'm putting it in the positive. I didn't say, look I have the standard because otherwise I feel ignored, no, no, no, no, no! We don't talk about that. We can talk about that when we are asked, or we can talk about that later on, but we want to know first what is it that we want right because if I don't know what I want how is anyone else supposed to know what I want.
Kathi 14:51
Yes
Daisy 14:52
So once I'm clear about what I want, then I can become clearer in communicating what I want, what my need is, in your case your need is a timely response. Because that makes you feel close then to the other person, that makes you feel appreciated. Inform them about that. Now question, do you believe they will feel inspired? Because motivation. We spoke about that in a different episode.
Kathi 15:18
Actually, we spoke about self-motivation two episodes ago and really got into the nitty gritty of it and renamed
it.
Daisy 15:28
Yes, that's true.
Kathi 15:29
So, if you haven't listened to that episode, yet, go and listen to it. It's a juicy one.
Daisy 15:36
But when I express my need, I like to receive responses in a timely manner, because really makes me feel connected to you, it makes me feel that you care for me because I care for you. I wonder, what do you believe how much the other person will feel inspired to respond to you in a timely manner?
Kathi 15:56
Well, hopefully a lot.
Daisy 15:58
I would say usually, a lot.
Kathi 16:00
I guess whether that happens or not, is a little bit of a gauge of how they value you.
Daisy 16:06
Well, you made a clear statement. Now what they do with it that's upon them Why? Let's go to the Australian Open. tennis. Yes, I like watching tennis. So one player just hits that ball with his racket, and then it lands in the other court. So now what does the other player has to do?
Kathi 16:24
Hit it back?
Daisy 16:24
Wait, is waiting until the ball comes back, is waiting, anticipation!
Kathi 16:29
This is a little bit faster than that! (laughter)
Daisy 16:33
Yes, I understand that, but it could have been out. We have to wait for the ball boys so that they give you a new ball, you see. But the player who serves needs to wait until the ball returns. Agreed?
Kathi 16:47
Yes. Agreed.
Daisy 16:49
And in the meantime, there's only anticipation.
Kathi 16:52
Yes.
Daisy 16:52
There's no frustration yet, right? Because we're talking about frustration here. Now,
Kathi 16:57
yeah,
Daisy 16:59
I'm waiting. Let's say let's go back to the person you informed that you really appreciate timely responses. Let's say they do not respond timely. Now, you already have a golden point here. Why? Because now you can communicate with them next time. Let's say they don't respond in a timely manner, you can ask them, hey, I wonder do you remember when I mentioned to you how important it is to me that I receive a timely response? Do you remember that conversation we just had the other day or the week, last year? And then what do you do? You wait again for the response? They either say, oh, no, I don't recall, I don't recall. Now you have the chance to inform them again. Because yes, it is possible that humans sometimes do not hear although they have two active, well working ears, but they just don't pay attention because they're busy with something else internally or externally. Agreed?
Kathi 17:52
Yes,
Daisy 17:52
that's human.
Kathi 17:53
Yeah, absolutely.
Daisy 17:55
Okay. So now you informed the person when they said, no, I don't remember. If the person says yes, I remember what about it? Then you can say, Well, I just wondered, so I mentioned to you how important it is to me to receive timely responses and I wonder what happened when I was waiting for your responses. And I waited for hours, and I waited for days and I wonder what happened? Can you help me understand? Oops, now, what's your frustration level? There's no frustration, agreed? You're in your power. There's no need for frustration yet?
Kathi 18:29
Hang on. I'm just thinking about this (laughter) and putting myself in that position. See how I would feel.
Daisy 18:35
Okay. Do it.
Kathi 18:37
I can see that at the point where they said, Yeah, what about it? That might frustrate me.
Daisy 18:43
Okay.
Kathi 18:44
To be honest.
Daisy 18:45
Okay, that might frustrate you.
Kathi 18:47
Yeah.
Daisy 18:47
Okay, good, good feedback. Now, the moment when you take your power back, instead of being frustrated, (that only causes more frustration), you reinforce your need, meaning, you tell them one more time. Look, I wonder what happened? Did you hear what I meant with that? What is it that you remember me saying about my need to receive responses in a timely manner?
Daisy 19:10
You see where I'm going with this? And then now they are on the spot? Now they can share what's happening within them? Yeah, well, you know, I was moving boxes in the shop, and I just didn't have the time. Maybe. Or they say, Oh, I totally forgot I was so tired. Or they say oh, yeah, well, you know, what is it so urgent? They will share with you what's going on within them, and therefore you can make adjustments, how important you want them to be in your life. That's your power.
Kathi 19:40
Yes.
Daisy 19:41
So you're not giving your power away by being frustrated, because that's not going to change a thing. And if that person, after that, still does not answer you in a timely manner, then they told you exactly who they are, based on their behavior. And it's not your purpose to change them.
Kathi 19:59
Yes, I agree, I agree. And listeners out there I'm going to refer to another episode because it's fundamental to everything we talk about so if you haven't heard episode one, "Who Are You" yet, I highly, gently, recommend (laughter) because it is all about 'we are how we behave' and we have to take ownership of that and we don't take ownership other people's behavior, that's on them.
Daisy 20:29
That's right you're not playing with the ball when it's in the other court why would you? No tennis player would ever think about doing that.
Kathi 20:37
It turned out to be a good analogy after all. I love tennis, I used to play. Actually it's one of the sports I truly love and I'll even watch, I just was a bit unsure of the analogy when we have to think about the ball in the beginning, but it turned out to be a good analogy because I can see now where you are going. You don't play with another ball or get frustrated that the ball isn't back, you wait for the ball, you can't do anything until the ball is in your court.
Daisy 21:13
Yes, and then why would you punish yourself, you double punish yourself when you do not speak up for your needs, because the other person is not a mind reader, not a super genius telepathic someone who's just connecting with your brain.
Kathi 21:30
Honestly Daisy i reckon there are hundreds and thousands of people out there that are like me and honestly do struggle with saying what they want. Whatever reason that got started, as in however it has evolved, I know for me it is probably the biggest challenge that I face is actually communicating in a great way with confidence to other people, especially those I'm in a relationship with. I think it's really important that we bring this up in topics like this because it shows how fundamentally key to any good relationship communication skills are.
Daisy 22:13
Absolutely.
Kathi 22:14
Look at you and I, it's a different kind of relationship, but we would never have been able to build the friendship and the trust that we have built over this last year if we couldn't communicate effectively with each other.
Daisy 22:26
That's right. Now, I would not have entered our relation if there would have not been that respect and the need for open communication.
Kathi 22:36
Yes
Daisy 22:37
And timely communication.
Kathi 22:39
Yes
Daisy 22:39
What we did over the past three months that, it's just bigger than other companies take five years to do.
Kathi 22:45
Yeah
Daisy 22:46
Well we shouldn't talk about that. I'm not sure that I want to talk about that. So one fundamental point that you just picked when you say that it's challenging for you to say what you need, we can end that problem in one simple concept.
Kathi 23:02
Oh great!
Daisy 23:03
One single simple concept,
Kathi 23:05
let's do it Daisy!
Daisy 23:09
I'm always excited to evolve, people.
Daisy 23:12
it's very easy. Look you're vulnerable, are you or aren't you?
Kathi 23:16
Yes
Daisy 23:16
So I'm vulnerable and I'm the same vulnerable if I show it or if I don't show it, agreed? And you're the same vulnerable, if you share it or if you don't share it, agreed?
Kathi 23:27
Agree
Daisy 23:27
So therefore why would you keep silent about it? It's fact, what are you trying to hide? Say it, say what you need, and you know what, what the other person responds to it is their responsibility, their opinion, and all that matters is how they will behave.
Kathi 23:43
Yes
Daisy 23:44
Watch people's behavior and you can learn all about them,
Kathi 23:47
yeah,
Daisy 23:47
and when they show you their colors oh, leave them.
Kathi 23:51
Yeah, yes and I was going to say that I truly believe that is how we have built such a great relationship is because fundamentally our values align.
Daisy 24:02
Absolutely and that's the key to all well-functioning relationships. But again where I see the problem lies, is that people do not communicate about their values, oftentimes because they never thought about their values. Then when they think about their values, my question is, what's your definition of these specific values. And when two people who meet, no matter for a friendship, for community building, for a business partnership, for a relationship, for family, then if they would start talking about their values after they did their homework, Okay what are my values, how am I defining them because only when I can define them, I will be able to speak about them and I will be able to communicate them and when then another person has a different definition then we can speak about them. You see that is how we can build a connection, connecting, that is how we then can test the compatibility.
Kathi 24:59
Yeah
Daisy 25:00
And not jumping into a relationship and then being frustrated, because the other person is neither mind reader, nor do they have our values because I didn't look enough. So actually, when I'm not looking, then it's the other person's fault? We take our power back and that's how we're going to do it. And one of the steps is, very important significant step, I'm vulnerable, and I know, so are you. But I'm courageous enough to speak about it, because even if I keep it secretly to myself, it's still there. And it creates more problems. And it creates even more vulnerability. And actually, I only want to surround myself with people where I can be vulnerable, because that is me. I hear so often in my practice, when clients call me and we work that 'yeah, you see, and I just cannot be me around them anymore'. Really? Why? Because they abandoned themselves. It's not about the other person. It's about them. So before we build up frustration, let's have a look at it. So there is something that you don't like, or you would like to have, or like to achieve or would like your partner would do for you. First of all, look at it what it is.
Kathi 26:06
Mmm, yes.
Daisy 26:07
And then second step, how does it make you feel? or What does it mean to you when the other person is doing what they're doing? Or not doing? What does it mean to you when they're not doing what you want them to do? And then let's start communicating that, instead of building up frustration, ulcers in the stomach, shaky hands, maybe then a pill here, some other coping skill there? No, no, no, no, no, we can keep that very low when we know how, that's my take on it.
Kathi 26:34
Mmm, I think you've summed it up nicely, Daisy, which removes the need for me to sum it up. I certainly have myself learnt from talking about this. And I can see that for me, there are two big keys here and it is knowing your values, and then being able to communicate them.
Daisy 26:53
So that is when you communicate them, that means you threw the ball. And now you wait, what ball they're sending you back.
Kathi 26:59
Yeah.
Daisy 26:59
And then look at that ball very closely. I mean, the ball, values, in this metaphor, what is their values? Have a look at them? Do you like them? Can you live with them? What is it that you like about them? What is it you don't like about them? And then communicate? We forgot to speak with one another. Not you and I, but humans?
Kathi 27:18
Yeah.
Daisy 27:19
So let's start talking about it, but first, talk with yourself. Not like in a schizophrenic setting (laughter). But we all speak for ourselves, but find out what is it that you'd like? You see?
Kathi 27:30
Yes. And I will just add here that please listen as well.
Daisy 27:35
Of course, because that's when the ball comes back. Listen, of course you're learning. Because when I'm only talking, throwing one ball after another on the tennis court, how do we ever establish a nice game, there will never be a match point.
Kathi 27:48
This metaphor is getting better and better Daisy, (laughter). So there you have it people, that is our podcast episode on frustration. I hope you had as much fun listening to that, as we have had making it lots of laughs today. But seriously, I personally have just learned something about myself and know what I need to work on in order for me to have a successful relationship when that time comes. So thank you for that Daisy. And I'm sure that the listeners out there appreciate you giving us that gold.
Daisy 28:26
I'm so glad to share. It's my passion and it's my life and it's my oxygen. It makes me alive. And I just love that. I just heard you say something, though.
Kathi 28:37
Oh,
Daisy 28:37
when you said I just learned something I need to work on. First, you don't need to. Second, it's not work. Just start communicating. Big kiss. That was it for today.
Kathi 28:51
You heard that guys. Okay, I'm going to rephrase that. I just found something I would like to evolve within
myself, is that better?
Daisy 29:01
Much better. But may I help you a little bit? A little bit?
Kathi 29:05
Sure, please do!
Daisy 29:06
I would not use the "I would like to". It's too far away.
Kathi 29:09
Okay. I'm going to...
Daisy 29:12
I'm in the process of
Kathi 29:13
okay.
Daisy 29:14
How's that? You like that?
Kathi 29:15
Well, I quite wasn't there yet. But now I am.
Daisy 29:20
Well, because you're just one decision away. I'm in the process.
Kathi 29:23
Yes, you're right. We are one decision and one choice away. I do believe that 100% and words matter. How do
we say things matter to ourselves, to other people? It matters. So don't react, respond and choose to be in the moment and take your power back guys.
Daisy 29:43
Absolutely. And you're in the process. And you know what? Me too. I'm in the process of growing and evolving. That's a human thing.
Kathi 29:52
Hopefully we all are.
Daisy 29:54
That's beautiful.
Kathi 29:55
And that is the point of our podcast, to help people evolve as we ourselves evolve, because nobody's there
yet.
Daisy 30:02
No one. No one is there yet.
Kathi 30:05
Perhaps the Dalai Lama would be the closest. But other than that, yeah, nobody's really there yet.
Daisy 30:10
Exactly
Kathi 30:11
but we're all growing and learning together
Daisy 30:12
and we're sharing, and we're sharing because we're caring. That's it.
Kathi 30:16
It is our passion to help you guys. So we hope you've enjoyed this episode. I know I've enjoyed making it
Daisy 30:23
Me too.
Kathi 30:23
Thank you once again, Daisy,
Daisy 30:25
My joy.
Kathi 30:26
We'll see you next week for another awesome, interesting and fun episode here on Bald and Blonde
Daisy 30:34
Mindset Evolution. Talk to you next time.
Daisy 30:41
Thank you for tuning in to the Bald and Blonde Mindset Evolution podcast. If you love what you're hearing, please subscribe to our podcast. In our show notes, you'll find the link to our Facebook group where you can personally connect with Daisy and Kathi and the link to our website where you can find all of our previous episodes and much more of goodies so you can get more value. Please leave us a review on Apple podcast or Podchaser, that really helps out the show and helps us to get some powerful feedback from you. Talk to you soon.